More forum fun

Yup... another one.

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That was a long post with not much content at all.

"MANs reasoning is what is not credible or definitive"

Maybe, but it is the only reasoning we ALL have, yes including you so I am sticking to it.

"you cannot find what you're looking for if you don't give credibility to even the things you see as ridiculous and without credibility"

Uh... what? Why would I give credibility to something that does not have or deserve any? Are you aware that with that kind of reasoning you could justify the belief in ANYTHING? Santa claus, the easter bunny, etc. Credibility is earned, it is not just given to things and when silly things in the bible make outrageous claims about the nature of the universe and so on... I will hold my beliefs until proper evidence is presented.

What you propose actually explains why theists are theists; you just want to believe and you accept things which should not be accepted to justify a claim.

"Give God a chance"

I did. I also gave santa claus a chance. Neither of them met their burden of proof but I must say that Santa is a lot more likely than an al knowing being.
"Work and seek with an OPEN heart. That is, do everything out of love"

I will pass but thanks. I will "work and seek" with an open MIND. I will do everything with intellectual honesty.

"do NOT go to other people to get your answers"

Sorry but I will pass again. I will verify my answers with others, I will compare my methodology to make sure whatever answers I get are actually correct. I will not just trust my own judgement, I will seek to understand things at a deeper level.

"ASK the tough questions, without ceasing"

Yes, great advice. I am already doing that.

"God is love"

We already have a label for "love" and that seems to work just fine. God seems to be anything theist want him to be. Can you demonstrate that god exists? Or are you just going to say something like "god is love" "god is understanding" "god is peace" because trust me I can find verses in the bible that show that if god is anything, he sure as hell is NOT love.

We are not made of emotion. We can have and experience emotions but we are not emotion.

" figure out is whether you want your emotion to be love or to be resistance"

That statement right there is flawed in at least two levels.

First of all, you presented a false dichotomy (love/resistance) of two terms that are not mutually exclusive and that (at least as far as you explained) have no connection to the subject at hand.

You also are fallaciously equivocating love and god but you have not demonstrated that god IS anything. We already have a label for love, and saying that god is love is not evidence of anything.

I figured out a few years ago that I want to be a man of reason, or rational inquiry who does NOT dictate his life with gut feelings, emotion or irrational beliefs. I am sure that some of your irrational beliefs make you feel good and better than some of the beliefs that I hold. But I actually give a flying fuck if the things are believe in are actually true or not and I will accept claims regardless of how good they make me feel. What matters if the evidence, not my emotional reaction to the evidence.

YOU have to decide if what you are seeking is truth, regardless of how it makes you feel or a pseudo explanation just because it give you comfort and a sense of meaning and purpose.

Forum debates

This is my response to a theist in a web forum.

Enjoy.

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" your logic is NOTHING compared to God"

Prove god exists for that to make sense please.

"Do you know who God is?"

I am waiting for you to tell me smart boy

"Have you even ever read the Bible all the way through?"

No, almost done though, I started about a year ago. But even if I had never picked up a bible before this.... you are once again... trying to divert the focus of the conversation unto me. Avoid it all you want, the questions I have raised remained unanswered and at this point it looks like not even god is helping you.

"you will never understand that you are the fool"


Prove god exists for that to make sense please.

"we try to answer your questions"

You have not even tried. Sorry but saying "you just do not get it" is not an answer. You would actually have to provide something for me to get or not get and you have not given me anything.

"you still reply with anger and hateful word"

Not anger nor hate, persiflage and ridicule. In any case, even if my response was anger and hateful words what have you provided? Nothing, absolute and pure NOTHINGNESS, no evidence, nothing to back up your statements and no defense for your god. Go ahead, keep trying to make this about me, but in the end the ball is still on your court and the burden is on you barbie.

"it seems to me that will only come after we accept whatever it is YOU say is right"

I am here to debate and question your beliefs. In the process I am interested in raising awareness to the irrationality and stupidity of some of the beliefs held by theists. I am all for a healthy debate, I never start the arguments by being disrespectful to people, beliefs maybe but never people. One thing that I rarely do (unless I am explicilty asked) is actually talk about the things I believe or actually express a position. So, when you say that I just want people to accept what I say... you are just lying or trying to avoid the issue (both perhaps?) because I have never said what I believe in and I have never told anyone that they should agree with me.

I have asked for evidence and just because you cant provide any doesnt mean I am making a statement about anything.

"Do you not know that discipline is just as important as freedom?"

Thats right barbie keep avoiding the subject. Good job.

"Your words reflect someone who is miserable and angry and VERY emotional...but deny it. And you try to hide behind intellect"

You are now starting to do these things people do when they know their neck is on the railroad tracks and the train is approaching. What you did right there is extremely dishonest and if this was a formal debate you would be booed off the soap box. The claim you made there is flawed in two respects:

1. Unverifiable: Whatever I do or say your conclusion will be the same. One of your premises is also part of your conclusion, making the logic circular (not logical). If I deny your bold assertion you will say "aha! I said he would deny it therefore I am correct!" and if I assert your premise then you will say "aha! I knew it!". Thats what like to call a "sissy move", you cannot defend your position logically so you try to defend it illogically.

2. Unsound: You seem to think that intellect is a bad thing and that faith is better. You are wrong. Even if you turn out to be right about god, and you are simply unable to defend the position, saying that blind faith is better than intellect is a fallacy, it simply isnt true.

I am passionate about this topic yes, but I always keep a cool head EVEN when I purposely try to offend people. I am not mad, I enjoy this a lot, I have fun doing this, I wouldnt do it if it made me angry. Trust me, I am not even on second gear yet, if I wanted to insult you I would have done that already. So far, all I have focused on is pointing out errors in your statements and your logic. You say that makes me an angry person, but I think you are just saying that because you have nothing else to say.

I have the love and acceptance of the creator of this universe who loves even you.

Prove god exists for that to make sense please.

"I have the promise of a wonderful eternal future"

Prove god exists for that to make sense please

"try to prove a negative"

I am not trying to prove anything barbie, I am trying to get YOU to prove YOUR claims. If you have not gotten than little part till now then no wonder you are a theist. I am waiting for your evidence, I am waiting to hear it. Just provide it, say you have none or get out of the way. There are people out there who are up to the challenge to defend their beliefs.

"Madeline Murray's son became a christian, his name is John Murray. Read some of his works"

This is what I do not get about people like you. There are two possible ways we could look at this and neither of them look good for you. Let me explain:

Here is a true dichotomy for you; you have either read the book or you have not.

Lets assume you read the book:

If you read the book and if you really believe that whatever arguments are presented in the book will be good enough to persuade me then you should also be able to just tell me what they are. If you read the book, if the arguments there are SOO awesome and if you really think that whatever is in there will "save me" (assuming you actually believe what you say you believe and you actually believe I need to get saved) then you would not wait for me to read the book and you would just tell me what those arguments are.

Lets assume you have not read the book:

Why the hell would you suggest a book you know nothing about????

I think you are showing clear signs of surrender my friend, please, stop wasting your time and my time.

Provide the evidence or move on.

Sounds good?

Sneak preview of theist response

I wont be signing into my facebook for a couple of weeks, I need the break and my girlfriend came home to visit me so I want to spend as much time with her as I can.

Anyways, I changed my facebook password and I am no longer capable of accessing my account, I wont be until she leaves. But I still receive facebook emails and email notifications so I can still have a few hours of fun late at night responding to these people.

This email response will not be sent to the theist until a two weeks from now but I will post it here so some of you who also follow my blog have some entertainment. Like always, I will change her name to some biblical name.

Enjoy.

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"Is that a sense of humor coming online?"

Oh yes, I am making fun of you and your lying and dishonest tactics. You are avoiding the issue in such a laughable way! You asked if I laugh much? Well the answer is yes. I laugh when theists like you shoot themselves in the foot by making outrageous and VERIFIABLE claims like the one you made about your predictions.

I would like to copy and paste something you said at the begining of the message "Will read it as soon as I have a little time". Just keep that line in your head for me ;)

You then proceeded to rant about how long and tedious your day is to make an excuse to your delayed response. I won't lie to you, I really do not care about all the things you told me. It is as relevant to the conversation as the color of the shirt I am currently wearing (by the way that's another thing you can ask your demon friends to tell you). The only reason I can think you would reply with such irrelevant nonsense is because you were cornered, couldn't find a way out and resorted to just whatever you could say to get out of your "pickle".

"You're having fun finding reasons to debunk God"

I am not debunking god... I am destroying the stupid and moronic arguments you are making. But hey, I shouldn't toot my own horn, your arguments fall on their own. Again, not god, YOU.

You claim to be swamped with email, and if that were true (which I do not believe for a second by the way) you wouldn't make time to NOT respond to what I asked you to respond to. You CLEARLY have plenty of time to tell me what happened on that Thursday and what was in that box; you sent me all the irrelevant little details you could muster about your life in several paragraphs. So you MADE time for me and you skipped the hundreds of emails you claim to hav in your inbox.

I am sorry ESTHER but I have a hard time trusting people I KNOW lie to get their way.

"Am I crazy?"

That depends on how you define crazy. If we define insanity as someone who hears voices and talks back to those voices the yes, you are insane asylum material yes. We could also use the other definition (doing the same action over and over again expecting different results) and we would still get to the same conclusion. I do not know why you think that telling me you are happy over and over again is persuading me in any way.

But I am starting to doubt even the sincerity of the claims you are making. I no longer think you actually experienced the things you claim to experience. No, I think you have deluded yourself to the point where you actually truly believe those things hapened to you when in fact you know they didn't. There is another explanation, maybe you really believe in god but you dint have any evidence to provide so you made an unverifiable, and outrageous claim that you KNEW cannot be proved or disproved just to see if maybe I would be persuaded a little.

"Hey, guess what, bet some of the people there ARE NOT perfect--but you wouldn't expect them to be perfect just because they're Christians, would you?"

No one is perfect. Perfection is not something that exists. If you spent a few minutes of your life learning about things you would know that perfection is an unnatainabke nature/trait. In other words perfection exists only in our heads, it is a label much like infinity which does not actually exist either.

So no, I wouldn't expect anybody (including insane people) to be perfect. And I would actually expect Christians to be way less than perfect, in fact more flawed and messed up that non Christians because in the end that is what your faith is and that is what the god you worship and believe exists condones; a free pass to be as immoral, messed up and crazy as you want as long as you promise to lick his balls for eternity after you finally get to leave his flawed creation. That is all he cares about, and that is what you worship.

You have lied to me, you have been dishonest to me and I have expected nothing but honesty from you. But it doesn't matter, and I really shouldn't expect anything better than that because you believe that the god you worship would rather send a lying and decieving believer than an honest and sincere nonbeliever. Your god rewards belief, not actions and that Ellen is enough for me to despise the very idea of the god you worship and the people that think that is right and moral.

It is damn peculiar that the god you believe in and worship seems to reward the things you do (whatever that is) and dislike the things thy you do not want to do.

Your god likes believers, and you seem to have no problem believing whatever people tell you. You are as gullible as a two year old. Your god also dislikes skepticism, rational inquiry and hard solid evidence which just so happen to be the things YOU CANNOT PROVIDE.

It seems that you have created a god for yourself, one that likes what you like and dislikes what you dislike.

Please stop bothering me with your nonsense now. I do not care if you are happy, I do not care if frosted flakes is your favorite cereal, I do not wonder what your family life is like and I could not care less how many unanswered emails you have in your inbox. I care about evidence, which is what I asked you to provide. You made verifiable claims and I asked for verification, if you can't do that then do not even bother sending a response.

I really think you won't respond to this but do not hesitate to respond if you are actually going to address my request. I won't hold my breath nor expect an answer so...

Toodles!

Ps: remember the line I asked you to remember? That response I just typed... I typed it in less than 10 minutes. If ibhave time to deconstruct your email about your life style and the other crap you sent me then I guess you have time to answer TWO simple questions. But hey what can I expect from a theist?

More Muslims

This is great lol

I am now debating Muslims. I guess christians got tired of me and just when I thought my debate days were over Muslims started to message me and shit.

Here is a conversation with a Muslim that sent me a couple private messages. Like usual, I will not disclose the writer's name so dont ask hyenas!

"Do you not believe in the former but only the latter? I really don't care what you believe I just think you should calm down your rhetoric which is sounding pretty anti-islam. Anyhoo love'd to chat at some point. However I added you as a friend on facebook but I'm going to have to briefly take you off until you reply back. Your picture is entirely ruthless to islam"

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What do you mean the former and the latter? Which one is the former and which one is the latter...?

And I AM anti Islam. I am anti whatever causes injustice death and terrorism.

And by the way I am an antitheist. I see no benefits coming from religion, just negative shit.

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"You are right about some sects of Islam causing injustice but just as red, green , and blue make up all the colors there are different sects of Islam.

If you've heard of the Tamil Tigers who are a Hindu extremist group it's not right to say all Hindus are extremists.

Another point, if you've ever heard of Mother Teresa, I think it's quite a stretch to say you see no benefits coming from her work as a Catholic nun."

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(thats what pissed me off lol)

Mother theresa was a rotten bitch.

The fact that people think she was good only shows how ignorant they are and how gullible they are. She didnt do ANYTHING that was good.

She believed that pain and suffering were GIFTS FROM GOD, which is why she never ONCE saved anyone, all the people that were ill and dying that went to her went to her to DIE. And every single one of them did.

She handled millions and millions of dollars but she never once reinvested money to the institutions she worked at, all the people that went to her seeking for help lived under the most dehumanizing conditions, rarely ate food, and were riddled with disease. She did NOTHING for them.

All the money she amassed during her life time was used to make more death centers like the one in Calcutta where people were not treated and they were just left there to die.

The ONLY possible benefit that she could have given to people was hope. But in this case it is false hope because she never bothered to prove that such a place as heaven existed and now it turns out she was not a firm believer like all people thought.

But guess what? Even if she did give people hope, the fact that hundreds died on her watch who only needed basic medical assistance turns her into a monster. She could have saved lives but she chose to preach. And there are secular ways to give hope as well.

But now lets move on to the abomination that is Islam and to your argument about fundamentalism being different from moderate religiosity.

If moderate islam stands by and does nothing while fundamentalist Islam is out there doing horrible things I CAN STILL HOLD moderate Islam accountable for enabling those fucked up sons of bitches to do whatever they want without saying (or perhaps more importantly) or doing anything.

If you are a moderate muslim or christian and you are trying to shift the blame to others by saying "oh well.. I dont believe in THAT part of the religion, those were fundamentalists" you are a coward. Its YOUR mess, its YOUR religion YOU should be out there protesting and trying to stop those barbaric sub humans from doing those things.

I never say that ALL muslims are evil because that is not true. But it is perfectly ok for me to say that ISLAM (the religion) is evil even if not all muslims are evil.

Which one is worse, the muslim that flies airplanes into building or the muslim that didnt do anything to stop him? One does the evil shit, the other allows it. Both are guilty.

And do not for a second assume that I have a grudge against islam, this applies to all religions.

Argument with Muslims

Do not reply if you dont want to, either way I sensed you would be running away sometime soon.

You are an ignorant fool. On one hand you praise the Quran because according to your preconceived conclusion about the divinity of its author some of the contents there predict scientific knowledge. On the other hand you REJECT the scientific knowledge that contradicts your beliefs. That is truly close-minded, you are not willing to consider that maybe, your religion is dead wrong because you know that if you apply the same scrutiny to your beliefs... they will be shred to pieces.

Ignore all the real evidence, and accept the faux bullcrap you have accepted as the truth, just because you are certain that what you believe in is correct doesnt meant it is. You have to demonstrate the things you believe in if you are going to tell others they are wrong.

make logical statements, I urge you to try to put your statements in a logical equation going from a major premise, to a minor premise to a conclusion. try to make your arguments sound, try to make them valid and see if you reach the same conclision you have reached so far.

In the end, you are not doing anything useful, you are just wasting your life, the only life you have as far as the evidence goes. Are you willing to take that chance? Are you willing to throw your ONLY life away because of this stupid belief system for which you have absolutely no evidence that would stand in a court of law? Are you that desperate to feel like your life has a purpose?

How pathetic, the thought of a universe that is indifferent to your existence bothers you soo much that you need god in order to feel like you are someone.

You do not need god man... you ARE someone even without god.

If god exists ask yourself this... does he really want you to be an irrational fool? is that what the alleged creator of human intelligence really wants from you? FAITH???

Follow the evidence, trust me it doesnt lead to god.

WOW. I have never seen so much ignorance in just a couple of pages.

"Logic as a science is an Aristotelian foundation that passed through the Muslims"

You FOOl. First of all, logic is based on logical absolutes, those absolutes are what they are and they are not what they are because of Aristotle or anyone for that matter. Islam was created around the 7th and 8th century AD, and Aristotle lived and died between 384 BC – 322 BC YOU ARE CENTURIES OFF.

"God is for risk takers not superficial nerds who demand technicality"

I am sorry but I give a damn if the things I believe in are true. You obviously do not.

" Also the logic of proof means that whatever we are proving has to be material, tangible, basically something that we can empirically deal with"

You dont know anything about logic do you. Proof is something that can only be used in logic and mathematics, anything else is just evidence. The logical absolutes ARE intangible, immaterial, and transcendental. If you were right there would be no way for us to prove that 2+2=4. YOU FOOL.

"God by definition cannot be empirical because that would be anthropomorphic"

Do you know what empirical is? You obviously have no idea what the word even means, thanks for proving god doesnt exist. You are telling me that god cannot be observed, experienced, or experimented. Not even experienced. Good job man.

"there is nothing like God"

What is god like then? You MUST know what he is like in order for you to say that there is nothing like god. Its the law of identity you fool. Tell me... what is god like?! And how could you possibly know there is nothing like god? Are you going to tell me that muslims are omniscient too? or even better, are you going to tell me that your god told you there is nothing like him? Give me a break man.

"Islam forbids superstition"

Islam IS superstition. All religions are. You guys are talking about things that do not exist, things that only exist in your heads and that have not been demonstrated to be true, much like the boogie man, the lochness monster, unicorns, and the chupacabra. There is no objective difference between your belief in god and the belief in santa claus.

"Furthermore, no Atheist can outcompete a Muslim in morality"

Which is why atheists fly airplanes into buildings, riiight. Even if that was true... it proves nothing, it has nothing to do with the subject at hand, why are you even going there?

"An Atheist will think of the golden rule only"

YOU FOOL. Atheism is not a belief, it is the lack of belief. Atheism has no dogmas, no tenets, no doctrines, no authority, we do not have a set of beliefs. I know atheists who dont give a damn about the golden rule, and I know others who do. I know atheists who reject evolution and I know atheists that accept it. Atheism is a NON-FACTOR in everything, it is nothing more than the rejection of theism.

What good thing has EVER come out of Islam besides terrorism, mutilation of female sex organs, injustice, death, suffering, superstition, faith, violence, segregation, sexism, oppression, hatred, genocide, blood shed, anger, atrocities, immorality, disaster, corruption, harm, malice, wickedness, vice, and the repugnancy of ignorant men?

And by the way, your stupid prophet also had ten wives. You know who else has plenty of partners? VULTURES, RATS, DOGS, ROACHES.

"Where has the traditions of empiricism and speculative philosophy gotten us?"

The computer you are using to read this, the technology you use to communicate, the knowledge that saves lives in hospitals, the wisdom in pharmaceuticals, in chemistry, in biology, the technology that allowed us to get to the moon, to understand DNA, to visit mars, to learn about the way in which our solar system and other solar systems work.

Should I continue?

"but its very hyprocrytical to demand something from our faith that you cannot provide yourself"

If I could provide proof of god... I wouldnt be asking you. What on earth are you talking about?

"We, however, are putting our faith in God, who is perfect"

PROVE IT. Prove that god exists FIRST then make those assertions.

"There would be no faith, if God announced himself to you"

You are OBVIOUSLY AND BLATANTLY WRONG. Did any of the prophets stop believing? Did the israelites stop believing? Satan knows with absolute certainty that god exists and still chooses not to worship him. So OBVIOUSLY god revealing himself to us would have no effect on faith.

"try to prove yourself to God"

First I have to believe that he exists, and before I believe that, it has to be proven to me. So I guess I am just waiting for you guys and for god. I wont be holding my breath.

"If i ask you where did the universe come from, you cannot give me a 100% factual answer, so dont demand one from us"

OK dude... you are comparing apples and oranges. I NEVER claimed to know how the universe came into existence, YOU guys did. You guys say that it was god, I have asked you to prove it and you have not. I dont have to explain how it happened BECAUSE I NEVER CLAIMED TO KNOW.

"the universe, with all its complexities, precision, corelation, structure, diversity, etc. is completely outside the realm of complete and total understanding by human beings"

I do not agree with you. We used to say the same about the way in which the body works, about the moon, about the stars, about electricity etc.

Just because we dont have an answer for something at the present moment in time does not mean that A) you get to just make some stupid story up and insert it in the gaps of our knowledge and CLAIM that it is true because we have no other explanation and B) it also doesnt mean that we never will understand it.

The truth is that the more we understand about the universe that surrounds us the smaller gods keep getting. Do you know how many gods before allah have come and gone with the discoveries of science? Do you know how many gods people have believed in throughout history but today are nothing more than a laughable bit of knowledge from our past? What makes you think YOUR imaginary friend will not be in that list two hundred years from now?

Your imaginary friend wont be around in centuries from now, either because you guys destroyed the world trying to defend him or because science, reason and logic finally got to him too.

THAT IS A REALITY. DEAL WITH IT.

Oh yes... the prophesy argument.

Finding something remarkable means you've found something remarkable, it doesn't tell you what the source is. In the case of supposed "Scripture Prophecy" - it's ALL nonsense. Predictions need to be specific and time-limited. Is it fulfilled prophecy when the waiter brings me the food I ordered? Of course not - which points out another problem.... prophecy can't be a statement that is publicly known, with many people actually working toward the achievement.

It also can't be ambiguous or prone to interpretation.

Show me a prophesy in the quran that made some OUTSTANDING claims. Did the verse say anything about the sun providing the light? Did it say anything about what allows the fetus to hang to the womb? Did it say anything about DNA? Evolution? DID it say ANYTHING specific, or just general statements which could be interpreted to mean anything?

"You claim there is no god, but fail to prove y not"

I never claimed god doesnt exist, I have asked you to prove your claims. I never made a single claim regarding the existence or nonexistence of god. I disbelieve in god which is different than believing that gods do not exists. Either way YOU are the one that has to prove your claims. Do not try to change this onto me.

"Where did we come from?"

Our parents, and so on. Its a NATURAL process called evolution.

"where did the universe come from?"

I really do not know. That doesnt mean you get to make your stupid imaginary friend up and say he did it. You actually have to demonstrate it.

You guys really think that just because we do not know the answer to the second question that you can simply say god did it and thats it?

WILFUL IGNORANCE.

Extra Credit

I am talking a comparative religions class and this was my extra credit assignment. We were supposed to create our own religion but I decided to just make an outline of the things needed to create one. The structure of this mildly inspired by Don Baker's lecture "rolling up your own religion" but the satire and most of the content is original.



Marco Otero
Mr. sodano
People and Religion
Monday, May 31, 2009
Make your own religion

Have you ever felt like an outcast? Have you felt like a singularity among your fellow human beings? Have you felt like a loser because all your friends are out there having sex with their girlfriends but you just can’t even make it past first base with a blind girl? Do you want to be able to offend others and hide behind some lame excuse? Do not wait any longer! A representative at Marco Otero’s Religion Manufacturer is waiting for your phone call and your money to help you have sex, get stoned and be a bigot in no time! Call now, our representatives are standing by!

We have the secrets to allow you to make your own religion and start destroying everything humanity has achieved during the past centuries TONIGHT. With us, you will learn the secret techniques used by false prophets, lunatics, copy cats and people who just wanted to see how gullible people were and the most common breed of religion creators: plain ignorant fools. Just give us a call and we will send you a free brochure with a complementary DVD absolutely free (1*)

But wait! If you call within the next ten minutes we will make this succulent offer even better by sending you a little plastic bottle that you can fill up with cat urine and say it is holy and spray it on people absolutely free! This will bring so much laughter and joy into your life that it will basically pay itself during the first use! Absolutely priceless! (2*)

But why would you want to do this in the first place? Well one of the reasons is that if you follow our steps you will probably end up with a lot of tax-free income and if you are lucky also a lot of sex. You will never have to work for a penny in your life, you might as well join the dozens of intelligent people who started their own religions and are currently enjoying the luxuries everyone desires at the expense of the ignorant and the sick!

You may be saying to yourself as this moment “But Marco, exactly what are you selling?” it is a great question and I am glad you asked. You see, over the course of human history humanity has developed a need to answer questions, but unfortunately for people out there, we have not yet developed the mental capacities to answer them. Luckily for us, our ancestors developed long and intricate answers that could not be investigated and are usually supported by no evidence at all. This is where the first of the ten secrets for a highly successful religion comes in!


Secret one:

Find a complicated question that has no answer… and make an answer up! This really is the easiest step, all you have to do is look for a real scientist, preferably in a physics branch of science or biology and ask him/her what question is still unanswered in his or her field of work! You have dozens of unanswered questions at your disposal! You can ask a scientist or pick one of the following: Abiogenesis, What is the universe made of? What is the biological basis of consciousness? How long can the human life span be extended? It doesn’t have to be an unanswered question, you can also pick a question for which science has answers but that is generally ignored by the average person such as quantum mechanics, quantum physics, and in the most third world countries you can also use evolution (3*).

Once you find the unanswered question make sure you make up an explanation, but not just any explanation if you know what I mean. Whatever story you make up to explain your question make sure that the facts cannot be independently confirmed; this is big because here is where the whole faith comes in. if your story involves a prophet, make sure the prophet talks to a god or special person while no one else is watching, or make sure that your story terminates the lives of the witnesses before any secular contemporary historian can get to them. We highly recommend you go with the alien intergalactic community, that is way better than the walking on water deal and the Immaculate Conception refried stories that have infested most religions already. We suggest the alien thing because it certainly is much more likely than the deity thing and smarter people will probably be more likely to believe it over the overrated son of god thing. Do not worry about the dumb ones; they will come to you like flies to rotten cabbages in no time.

If you ever get writers block, find a way to tie your religion to an already existing religion. Do not feel bad if you get to this point, almost every single religion out there has done this, and it works wonders. If you can’t find how to get from point A to point B in your story look in the bible and find some detail that was not really given and make it up! Fulfill a prophecy in the Quran! Mormons did it with Muslims, Muslims did it with Christians, Christians did it with Jews and Jews did it with the pagan religions of the Mediterranean. Look at the most successful religion to ever come out of Marco Otero’s Religion Manufacturer enterprises – the Raelians. They created a religion using Elohim, a term in Christian religion that refers to the race of people that Yahweh belonged to.
Once you have a good, detailed and unverifiable story to your unanswered question you may move on to the next step.


Secret two:

Get and maintain a following. This will be harder now, but certainly not impossible. If you call us now you will be able to know the secrets to help your religion grow and start having sex with women near you! Get people around you to come and follow, call your friends and tell them about your story and make sure that the friends of the ones that do not reject you and cast you out as a lunatic are inserted into the equation soon. Get the family members of your friends and then the friends of their family members and so on. Eventually you will have enough people and enough money to build institutions around them and make the growth exponential. Whenever you encounter a problem look at the other religions around you and try to understand how they solved their problems to get a better perspective of how to go around people’s intellects. Remember, one man’s theology is another man’s belly laugh, make sure you learn all you can from the other religions around you and start getting your own flock of sheep today!
How do you get believers in the door though? This will take us to the third secret in our program.


Secret three:

Make yourself special. After you finish concocting your random story make sure that somewhere in there you are anointed as special or as the chosen one. You can use the label “prophet” if you want and saying that something was “divinely inspired” seems to get a lot of people behind any silly story so make sure you also use some kind of supernatural explanation for your unusual and out of the ordinary knowledge. You can say that some angel or alien visited you during the night while no one was watching or you can say that you turned to the heavens and asked for rain and it did. Whatever you chose make sure you keep in mind that nothing you say can be verified, only those who manage to forge an incredible story and still make is unverifiable survive. When was the last time you saw a person literally worshiping a tree?! NEVER! It just doesn’t happen anymore! As soon as you make the mistake to make a verifiable claim your religion will be left with just a few more years to live. If that.

You may also find a couple buddies to help you here. You can say that aliens visited you and that you were chosen as the new messiah of the human race or something along those lines. Ask your friends for help, tell them to play along for a while and to tell people that they were there and that they say the aliens you speak about. After you get enough people to believe them, make sure you get rid of them, we are not suggesting you kill them but… it may help. After all the less people who really know the truth behind your religion the better, because that way you can keep all the money and sex for yourself.
Be creative! When people ask about the witnesses and their disappearances you can say something like “well… the umm… aliens took them last night!”. Make sure you hide the bodies deep inside a forest and don’t forget to spray deer urine on the bodies to prevent hound dogs from finding them.

Once you insert yourself into the story as the special guy with special knowledge you may move on to the next step which is even trickier.


Secret four:

Link people to the story. Once your story manages to answer some big question make sure you find a way to give people a sense of place in the universe, a sense of direction or maybe even just the feeling of well being. It doesn’t matter if you answer the questions truthfully, as long as they believe that you did and as long as they believe that it is important to believe it. Remember, you are now the prophet! Find a way to make the revelation of the story a dramatic scene, tell them it is a sacrifice that you are making or at least make them think it is. This secret is closely tied to the fifth secret.

Secret Five:

Divide people. Make sure you create the story in a way that divides those who believe in from those who do not or those who believe in another story. Create the “us and them” mentality and you can get away with everything. Some key concepts to keep in mind that may help you are the following:

1. Refer to those who do not believe in derogatory ways such as fool, infidel, ignorant, close-minded or anything that makes them “incomplete”.
2. Make the believer think that he or she is being persecuted. You can get people to believe anything, but in order for them to be ready to give more they have to believe that they are being persecuted for believing it.
3. Those who tell your believers that their religion is a fraud are liars and should not be trusted
4. Those who mock or criticize the religion are evil and only care about hating.
5. People who believe the story are special, they are the chosen ones. A special fate awaits those who believe.
Remember to follow all the previous steps before you get to this one!

Step Six:

Give people hope. You can do this by telling them that if they believe in your story they will be rewarded after they die of that the more money they give the happier they will be. Whatever you do, make sure that people get a sense of security or justice even if it is completely fabricated. One of your followers has a problem at worked and asked you for advice? Tell them that if they pray with their whole heart the problem will be resolved. Is anybody in your congregation sick and about to die and there is nothing anybody can do? Tell them that faith will cure their disease and that if it doesn’t maybe it was part of a grander plan!

People don’t want to know the truth, the truth is not consoling and they will believe whatever you tell them if they feel something warm and fuzzy inside of them. Tell them that if they feel something (make sure you do not define the feeling, ever) that that is irrefutable proof that the belief is true.


Secret Seven:

Develop a never ending cycle of emotional manipulation. Once you get a solid base of believers and a workable story with no independent confirmation make sure that you find a way to make your story circular. Maybe the alien in your religion loves his or her creation but hates them just enough to expect them to do silly things periodically and on a regular basis. Make sure you go after those who are weak or ill and those who are away from home. Hospital folk are great; they are tired of their sickness and would like to know why it happened to them. Look at people at airports, universities and other places where you would expect to find young, naïve and lonely people.
Sexual repression is another good way to keep them in a loop. Make sure you make some sort of taboo around their sexuality. You can either tell them that they cant have sex altogether or the complete opposite, tell them that they are expected to have several partners and lots of sex. Tell them that masturbation is wrong or tell them that no matter what they do or think, a higher being knows, that way they will be in inner conflict all the time and some will come back to you over and over again. Again, be creative.

This is a very good secret because you can now start to tie in several secrets. Tell them that they are supposed to hate those who do not agree with them, tell them that the only way to be a good person is to convert and “enlighten” those near them or around them. Manipulate their emotions and manipulate the information around them. Tell them that people out there will be trying to reconverts them and that people out there who are full of hate will come to them with facts and numbers but that they are doing the work of some evil being and to ignore them at once.

Secret Eight:

Go after the children. Encourage the members to bring their families into the religion. Praise those who manage to convert their entire families and treat them better than those who show up alone. Tell them that they cannot be moral families if they are not of your particular religion. Go after the children, it is a lot easier to convince a 5 year old that the invisible alien is real because they are not old enough to think for themselves and around that age they accept most of what authority figures tell them about the world. Take advantage of their gullibility. Most children who are indoctrinated at an early age tend to stay in that religion and are more likely to indoctrinate their children when they are older. Keep in mind that religions are much like a mind virus, make sure you get the children infected, the younger they are the harder it will be to cure the disease.

Religion is intertwined with the family structure because it is a parasite of the family structure. Once you have these rules taken care of… retire! Let your sheep do your work for you now! Tell them to go to other countries and covert people, tell them to create rites of passage, myths, legends, moral panics, secret handshakes, and even lobby political candidates to pass laws allowing your religion to be considered as a special religion. Once you get to this point you are done, the religion will now have a life of its own.
These rules are guaranteed to make you a millionaire in no time and to have as many sexual partners as you want if you follow them. We can only give you a few of the rules but if you call now you will receive the entire set of rules and complementary twister board to enjoy your remaining months as a hard worker before you become lazy, overfed and supported by the poor.
We hope you enjoyed the introduction and we expect your check in the mail soon. Have a blast.










1* the brochure and DVD are free with a 5 dollar sign up fee. Shipping and handling fees may apply.
2*Marco Otero’s Religion Manufacturer does not endorse physical assault on people including but not limited to spraying people with cat urine, moose urine, deer urine, pubic hair warm beer or anything of the like. Marco Otero’s Religion Manufacturer and none of its affiliates assume no responsibility for any laws that are infringed with the knowledge acquired in the course.
3* The evolution scam will only work in underdeveloped democracies with the exception of the United States.